Power Up Wealth podcast – Knowledge Is a Powerful Defense – Episode 74 transcript:
Sharla Jessop 0:00
Scams are not new to society. They’ve been going on for many, many years. There are always bad actors, crooks, trying to separate you from your money. I’m Sharla Jessop, President of Smedley Financial, and today, my guest and colleague, Shane Thomas, will explain why knowledge is a powerful defense against bad actors.
Shane Thomas 0:28
Welcome to the SFS Power Up Wealth podcast, where we provide impactful insight and expert opinions on timeless financial principles and timely investment topics, preparing you to make smarter decisions with your money.
Sharla Jessop 0:51
Shane, thank you for joining me today.
Shane Thomas 0:53
Thanks for having me.
Sharla Jessop 0:54
It’s nice to see you on this side of the microphone. Shane is the IT Specialist for Smedley Financial, and he’s the producer of the Power Up Wealth podcast and designs all of our social media posts. Shane, it seems like every day we hear about good people who lose their money to scams, some we know personally, and these are good, smart people. How does this happen?
Shane Thomas 1:14
To start with, the bad actors are always looking for an opportunity to take advantage of anyone, whether it’s young people, old people, people in the middle, they’re always, as you could say, they’re always on the prowl. There’s no shortage of the bad actors, and there’s no shortage of ways they’re looking and always trying to evolve. You could say, to take advantage of people.
Sharla Jessop 1:37
They are so creative. When I hear of scams and I see scams, I think these people are so creative, it’s unfortunately, they can’t use that creativity and energy to do something good rather than to dupe people from their money.
Shane Thomas 1:48
Sure.
Sharla Jessop 1:48
So you had written in your Money Moxie article, Knowledge Is a Powerful Defense, about several different types of scams. Talk to us a little bit about some of those scams.
Shane Thomas 1:57
In the past you could distinguish them by, you know, the Nigerian prince asking for money, or they were simple scams, and they still caught people, and they were successful, the bad actors were and then people got smarter, and so they had to become better, and, you know, more crafty with their scams. And it is unfortunate that that’s what they do, because the bad actors are smart people just using their smarts the wrong way. But the scams now are plentiful. There’s the pop ups for Windows. There’s a problem with it. Call this number. We can help you. There’s, you know, your your information’s been compromised, or your machine’s not working right. We can help you with that. Those scams are plentiful because, and they work really well, because some people say, oh, there is a problem with my computer. Oh, it’s not working right. Oh, and these guys can help me. And they sound convincing that they’re there and they’re build trust and they build rapport, and you easily fall prey to that, thinking, oh, yeah, they’re here to help me. There’s a problem with my computer, and they’re right there. I can call the number. They answer they Oh, we can help you. We can just log right in. We can help you right then another scam is romance scams, or sweetheart scams, or military scams. Somebody is overseas and they can’t meet you in person, but you know, I’d love to if I could, or if you could send me the money so on my next leave, I could come and visit you. Oftentimes people are lonely, and these bad actors prey on that loneliness, and, oh, send me pictures. Oh, I’d love to meet in person. Send me money so I can get a plane ticket to come visit, you know. And these lonely people are like, hey, someone’s paying attention to me, someone’s interested in me. And the person on the other end could be whoever they want. They can send pictures that could be of anyone, and you fall victim thinking that that’s really who that person is, and it’s not. And they take advantage of people’s trust.
Sharla Jessop 3:50
It’s understandable. I think that’s probably the key. Is these people are very good at seeming like the guy next door or the woman next door, and very friendly. You don’t pick up right away that these are bad actors, and they are in the process of building trust with you as they have a conversation with you.
Shane Thomas 4:06
Right! They could have already looked up your information on Facebook or Instagram or Tiktok or LinkedIn and got information, maybe about you or things that you like or enjoy to try to convince you that they also like those same things. You know, maybe on your Facebook page, you have it locked down, but you might still share certain things about recipes that you like or places you like to travel, or things you like to do, and they see those things, and then they also maybe like those same things, and it instantly builds this trust and rapport with you as you believe that, oh well, they like to go to, you know, Florida and the beach, and I like to go to Florida and the beach. Well, you instantly feel a little more comfortable with that person. And that’s what they do, and that’s the first hook you could say and they gradually pull you in. And pretty soon they’re, you know, oh, send me this, or send me that, or I’d love to meet in person. Or they know that those are the things that trick people.
Sharla Jessop 5:10
And build rapport. They they trust that. I know you, you know me. Another one you said was, or that you talked about in the article was government impersonation. Tell us a little bit about that.
Shane Thomas 5:19
So you’ll find you might get a phone call from someone thinking that you have taxes due, you’re missing some kind of a document. And so these guys will pretend to be an official person from, you know, some official place in the government, and you feel like, Oh, well, this person, I must do whatever they’re saying if they’re officially with the government. And there again, they build on that trust when they also build on fear, thinking you might be obligated to pay. So fine, like, oh, did I forget a parking ticket? Oh, I didn’t. I didn’t know that. They build on that you getting, you know, fear or scared that you’re not in compliance with something with the government, and that they could come and, you know, repossess your car, or you’ve got back taxes that you haven’t paid, and that fear, and so you stop thinking correctly, because you’re you’re scared, and that’s one of the tactics that they use. And so you’re immediately, well, what can I do to avoid some penalty or or jail time, or, you know, anything like that. And you could wire the money to us, or you could buy gift cards, and that will suffice.
Sharla Jessop 6:22
You know, another one that it just makes me wonder, because impersonating family or friends has been going on for years, where you will receive a call from a child who is in jail in another city or another country, and they need you to send the money. They’re so sorry, they don’t want to call their mom and dad and tell them, because they’re going to be so upset. Would you please do this? I wonder what is happening when you add in the progression of artificial intelligence into that scenario.
Shane Thomas 6:48
Using artificial intelligence, using AI, has ramped up a lot, especially in the last few years. People in general, using AI to create documents, help you type things, make it sound better. They’re using AI for voice and oftentimes images as well. So if they have enough information, as far as audio, they can take that and splice it and make it sound like the real person. And that’s where an individual who might be in another country or, I’m, you know, instead of going, I don’t want to call my parents, grandma, would you mind helping me, and they could use the audio from other conversations, things they’ve pulled online, the bad actors, splice that together and it sounds like your grandson or granddaughter. And you might be like, Oh, they are really in trouble. And what could I do? And the first thing you want to do is help, and you trust that, oh, this is really, you know, somebody in my family. The other thing with with AI is the bad actors were typing emails out, and there would be misspellings. The grammar was terrible. They weren’t using what we would consider proper English. Well, they’ve gotten smarter. Just as we might use chat GPT, which is an AI document writing program, they also were using it, and they’re using it, as we’ve said in the so far in the podcast, for bad reasons. You know, we use it to help improve our grammar or to write something for us. Well, guess what? They’re using it as well, and the emails they’re sending are more convincing. They’re written well. The spelling is great in it. It’s no longer the weird words that are out of place, they look really good. And unfortunately, they’re using that, and more people read it and are falling victim. And I don’t see that slowing down at any time, because the better that technology gets for us to use, they’re also using it on their end, and it just gets better and better. And the key is to stay vigilant.
I think for everybody to be vigilant and not trust. I mean, we want to trust everybody. Human nature to want to trust people, but you have to be skeptical from the start. If you received an email and you weren’t expecting it, don’t open that attachment.
Right? If you get a text message and it isn’t something you were expecting, or you’re not sure what it is you know, or if it’s from someone you know and it looks suspicious, you can call them the old fashioned method, call the person.
Sharla Jessop 9:01
Like, actually have a voice conversation.
Shane Thomas 9:02
Right? Or you get an email, and you weren’t expecting to have, you know, a spreadsheet about a trip or something from somebody. You’re like, well, why would they have sent me that? Or a Word document or a PDF or a picture? And unfortunately, that’s the world we’re living in. And if you’re not expecting it, don’t open it. Give them a call. Say, Hey, did you mean to send me that? And maybe there’s a problem with their email. Maybe a bad actor has somehow compromised their email and is sending that information out to all the people in their contacts in hopes of catching at least one, if not more people.
Sharla Jessop 9:34
DocuSign is another issue. We use DocuSign quite often here for signing forms. If you receive a document requesting a signature, don’t open it to sign unless you know that it was coming for you, because they are trying to even use DocuSign to get you to open it up and sign a false document.
Shane Thomas 9:53
Correct. Yeah, they’re using DocuSign or yeah, or SignX. There’s many different programs, but if you’re not actively working with someone to you know whether you’re closing on a house or a loan, or with us, opening up accounts. If you’re getting some information through email that says, oh, here, click here to sign this, and you’re not really actively looking at something, don’t click on it. Don’t go out there and open that or sign anything. Chances are it’s fake, and you won’t know that until you’ve already gone and clicked that. The best thing would be reach out to the person and say, Hey, did you mean to send me this? I got this from you. Did you mean to if it’s from someone you don’t recognize, just delete it. You know, don’t even read it. Don’t do anything with it. Just delete it. Send it to your junk folder. That is a scary new way that they’re getting it, because oftentimes you’re like, Well, I don’t remember doing paperwork, but maybe we needed to fill something out, and they click on it, and immediately it shuts down their stuff. The other thing that is phone calls. If you get a phone call and you’re not sure who it is and don’t answer it, you don’t owe that person anything.
Sharla Jessop 10:55
So I gotta tell you, that goes against everything we’re taught. Because polite society would say, if someone calls you, then you pick up the phone and say hello and have a conversation.
Shane Thomas 11:02
Oftentimes, you might see that it’s, you know, aunt or grandma calling you, and you think, Oh, that’s really them. And you answer it, and then you realize that’s not them, because unfortunately, the bad actors can spoof the caller ID, so it looks like it’s from somebody you might know. So you answer it, and if they start saying things in your like, this isn’t who you thought it is, hang up. It’s gonna be okay. You can hang up the phone. You don’t have to listen to them. You don’t have to answer their questions. The best thing is to just hang up the phone.
Sharla Jessop 11:34
Good advice. What other things would you advise people to do as they listen to this? You know, scams are, we talk about this often and but it’s something we can never talk about enough, because we hear of people who have been scammed out of money.
Shane Thomas 11:47
Yes, you know, unfortunately, the bad actors only have to be right once. You know, we have to be right all the time, and they only have, they only have to be right once. If they get one person to click on that link or open that attachment, or if a pop up, shows up and it says, oh, call us, there’s a problem. And they get one person to call. That’s all they need. And they just will keep going and going. So really, the best thing is, if you see something, stop and check it out. And before you do anything else, if you have questions, talk to someone you trust. If you’re not for sure, you know, ask someone and see, you know, have someone else look at it be like, does this look right? If you’re like, if you’re not sure, you know, reach out to someone that you trust to have them also take a look at it. Anyone who’s rushing you into sending money or buying gift cards or investing in cryptocurrency, most likely is a scam. If it’s too good to be true, it’s a scam. You know, if those items you’ve been looking at are substantially discounted through this special company’s website. Chances are it isn’t real. They’re not selling you a pallet of those at a discount. Never click on links or respond to unexpected messages. Don’t trust the caller ID. If you think what they’re telling you sounds legit, ask them for their callback number. Maybe Google a company and call them directly back at the number that you find on their official website, not who you know from someone calling you. Don’t pay anyone who demands that you pay with a gift card. They’re not going to call and say, Hey, pay me with a Visa gift card that you bought at the grocery store.
Sharla Jessop 13:18
It’s not really a form of currency.
Shane Thomas 13:20
No, no. And if they demand that you pay with a money transfer or cryptocurrency, chances aren’t that’s not legitimate way of payment, or even through a payment app. You know, pay through legitimate means, so you have some sort of course of action if there’s a problem. I would also add, if you want more information, you can go out to the FTCs website. They have a whole bunch of information for individuals. If you’ve been a victim of a scam, what you can do steps, to take. For businesses as well. Steps that they can do to help their their customers, and that’s at ftc.gov/scams as well as business.ftc.gov.
Sharla Jessop 14:03
Shane, thank you. Information that is so valuable that will help people not become victims or not fall victim to some type of a financial scam.
Shane Thomas 14:13
Yeah, hopefully if it helps one person, then it’s been helpful.
Sharla Jessop 14:16
Great. Thank you.
Shane Thomas 14:17
Thank you.
Thank you for joining the Power Up Wealth podcast. Smedley Financial is located at 102 S 200 E Ste 100 in Salt Lake City, UT 84111. Call us today at 800-748-4788. You can also find us on the web at Smedleyfinancial.com, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and LinkedIn. The views expressed are Smedley Financials and should not be construed directly or indirectly as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks, including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice. Securities offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc., member FINRA/SIPC. Investment advisory services offered through Smedley Financial Services, Inc.® Osaic Wealth is separately owned, and other entities and/or marketing names, products, or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.
